I have a question for XE3 owners...
I have a question for XE3 owners...
I love Delphi, but for the first time in several years I've decided to skip on a new version (XE3). I had high hopes for FM, but with XE2, I feel that most of my expectations were not met. The concept of FM is great, but it wasn't refined, missing lots of components, anchors and more... So, my question is, do you feel that FM2 is ready to be used in a production environment?
I love Delphi, but for the first time in several years I've decided to skip on a new version (XE3). I had high hopes for FM, but with XE2, I feel that most of my expectations were not met. The concept of FM is great, but it wasn't refined, missing lots of components, anchors and more... So, my question is, do you feel that FM2 is ready to be used in a production environment?
IMHO FM has little chance of surviving, but that's just me.
ReplyDeleteOn the other hand, if you want all the bells and whistles that come with XE3, then it's a no brainer... you can just pretend that FM is not part of Delphi. (:
Well, I already own XE2, I don't think that XE3 would offer me anything I would actually use if FM2 still isn't really there yet.
ReplyDeletestill don't work for me, but datasnap in update1 it's satisfactory
ReplyDeleteYou And i wait fm3 and 3 parts components
ReplyDeleteI have the same question - readiness for production.
ReplyDeleteI'm also hoping to see Linux support in XE4, that is in my opinion, more important than mobile atm...
ReplyDeleteFrédéric Hannes they can't just "add" linux support, it will take at least 2 releases of delphi until they make it "work", in the meantime you can target linux using Lazarus + FPC
ReplyDeleteif we do not want to do anything to linux could create a proxy class for the lazarus with datasnap, I know you only use xe4 if improve performance datasnap near mormot or wcf
ReplyDeleteDorin Duminica I'm not saying they can, I'm saying it should be a priority. Also, the step from OSX support to Linux support should be smaller than Win to OSX was, as the OSX kernel was originally forked from the Linux kernel.
ReplyDeleteFrédéric Hannes IMHO the only value of Delphi is the ability to quickly get from "idea" to "prototype" and "release" because of the VCL *and * db components, take visual designing out of the game and it's pretty much "just another language".
ReplyDeleteIf they are to target linux, they have to get their s. together and make FM work or come up with a replacement for VCL which is cross platform -- I think they got this, hence the release of FM.
that's my 2 cents...
I always viewed FM1 as a technical preview. I'm hoping we see true iOS capabilities in XE3 in the next 6 months which will enable me to start a production app.
ReplyDeleteI have not even tried FM2 after the cluster fuck that was FM. EMBT really fucked up when releasing a half-baked FM platform which turned out be a dead end. Will I try it again? Probably - but not right now . I'd hate to be a guinea pig again.
ReplyDeleteLars Fosdal awch!! ((:
ReplyDeleteAnybody remember Kylix? CLX was meant to replace the VCL and make cross platform development just a matter of recompiling. It even worked, kind of. And then Borland killed it. FM immediately reminded me of that disaster. But I still hope they get it right this time. I would really like to get my hands on a true cross platform version of Delphi. But so far I am not convinced. I am not going to port any code to FM until I have seen Linux support for it. On the other hand, there is Lazarus, maybe that's the way to go.
ReplyDeleteI never really got Kylix to work myself.
ReplyDeleteFM2 is a great improvement for FireMonkey, and fixes most of the relevant issues. There are still areas in which performance is at stake, and I won't claim it is perfect, but more than usable. And coming to iOS real soon.
ReplyDeleteThere were a lot of reservations in that post, Marco :)
ReplyDeleteI think the concept is great - but FM should never have been released.
Good to hear that FM is making progress, though personally, I'd like to see support for Linux, Android and iOS in that particular order. Though, I imagine that iOS is the biggest market, so from a economical point of view, I suppose that would be the best to focus on first.
ReplyDeleteFrédéric Hannes IMHO iOS is the place to make money, so I'd lobby for iOS first, then WP8 and the rest...
ReplyDeleteGive FM a chance. I see great potential.
ReplyDeleteDorin Duminica I couldn't agree more! Rapid native development is the major selling point of Delphi.
ReplyDeleteDorin Duminica - I'm selfish, so I'd like Android before the rest :)
ReplyDeleteLars Fosdal we all are (:
ReplyDeletePhillip Woon FM requires a lot of dev time, if I understood how emb wants to make money, they'll just drag it for years and eventually kill it -- really hoping to be wrong!!
ReplyDeleteDorin Duminica Android has 75% of the worldwide market share. iOS, a little under 15%. Blackberry, around 4%. Based on recent reports, Android and iOS dominated new activations the holiday season, i.e. WP still MIA. Given all this, Android is given lowest priority and classified as "the rest?"
ReplyDeleteI think the iOS feature was already in the product (for when iOS had the market share - in XE2). Now that Android is now the king, they're working on it.
ReplyDeletePerhaps Borland got the VCL right the first time (in Delphi 1), but FMX is a brand new framework. I think you'll have some growing pains at first, but eventually, it'll become mature.
ReplyDeleteKyle Miller - is that weighted by # of devices sold, or app store turnover?
ReplyDeleteFrédéric Hannes Kylix was a bust, and consumed substantial resources. Without arguing technical merits, I would assert that it is unlikely a real market exists for Delphi on Linux. the Kylix adventure showed that producing something which can be installed on any and every Linux distribution is a challenge, and I believe that if it cannot, that's a big fail, at step one. But the completely unanswered question is who will buy tools to work on Linux? These people are accustomed to free tools, free OS, and many (most?) will continue to favor the same. Moreover, Linux people have to have significant C skills, just to stay afloat, so why turn to a different language?
ReplyDeleteMobile and Mac are at least commercial markets; Linux may not be.
Michael Thuma Not only new sales. Android has the largest installed phone user base worldwide at 52% and rapidly growing. And look at the app install #'s, #'s a developer likes to see. http://www.examiner.com/article/android-market-share-holds-strongest-for-2012
ReplyDeleteBill Meyer I don't see how your last argument applies. RAD Studio is only available on Windows, so it's fairly safe to assume that most of it's users are Windows users.
ReplyDeleteFrédéric Hannes It is not clear that making Linux a target for executables is any less difficult than making it the host for Kylix.
ReplyDeleteThey might have to speed up Linux targeting, since now they've announced Ubuntu for smartphones
ReplyDelete