I agree with Jeroen Wiert Pluimers . I've never seen the point of integrated IDE support for a DVCS. Back when I used products like Peforce, and one had to check-out files to work on them, IDE integration was handy, but that's just not the case with a DVCS. Also, most projects (at least mine) have files under version control that are not specific to Delphi, so I'll be using my VCS tool of choice anyway. For me, managing my repositories is a task completely separate from coding/development.
Well, then there is no need for integration of SVN--it's just clutter. I think the point is that if SVN is supported, why not Hg and Git? Makes as much sense for each of them.
Jeroen Wiert Pluimers Kevin Powick I had similar thoughts until I started to use Android Studio more. While integrated VCS will not give you access to full power of your VCS, it is much easier to use for minute to minute tasks.
Bill Meyer because SVN supports locking (though highly disrecommended). I never really used the Delphi SVN integration. Too little added value over the existing tools I used.
Jeroen Wiert Pluimers That only shows that the integration is not good enough. The most common operations could be made from the IDE without the need to use another tool.
But to work you'd need to have Delphi duplicate most of the functionality of the GUI tools. I mean, it's vaguely pretty that NetBeans highlights changes files in the file view, but its diff tool is junk and branch/merge operations don't work as well as the command line (and that's saying something). Could embarcingmad do even that well? I am not confident. Should they do that instead of bug fixes? Hell No!
Moz Le They really should put their major focus on the language and the compiler itself. Then on the IDE and providing a proper API (OTA) for 3rd party to build all kinds of extensions. Everything else can be done by 3rd party vendors.
Stefan Glienke I agree that the most important parts are the language and the compiler. But they will need to polish other areas too. And not all can be left to 3rd party.
You cannot trying to sell modern tool set that only has support for SVN. Currently even no VCS integration at all would look better.
Dalija Prasnikar With a proper infrastructure that would be no big deal but currently the OTA is more like a book with seven seals to most people so they don't bother with it. That and the lacking API for important things like code analysis or refactoring are the reason there are only like a handful top quality IDE plugins out there. And every single of them uses their own code parser to do things. I don't know how much comes with a VS out of the box nowadays for example but who cares with the trillion of plugins that are out there.
I think that IDE's can never beat the VCS experience that VCS tools themselves can offer, especially in a non-locked DVCS environment.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Jeroen Wiert Pluimers . I've never seen the point of integrated IDE support for a DVCS. Back when I used products like Peforce, and one had to check-out files to work on them, IDE integration was handy, but that's just not the case with a DVCS. Also, most projects (at least mine) have files under version control that are not specific to Delphi, so I'll be using my VCS tool of choice anyway. For me, managing my repositories is a task completely separate from coding/development.
ReplyDeleteWell, then there is no need for integration of SVN--it's just clutter. I think the point is that if SVN is supported, why not Hg and Git? Makes as much sense for each of them.
ReplyDeleteJeroen Wiert Pluimers Kevin Powick I had similar thoughts until I started to use Android Studio more. While integrated VCS will not give you access to full power of your VCS, it is much easier to use for minute to minute tasks.
ReplyDeleteBill Meyer because SVN supports locking (though highly disrecommended). I never really used the Delphi SVN integration. Too little added value over the existing tools I used.
ReplyDeleteJeroen Wiert Pluimers That only shows that the integration is not good enough. The most common operations could be made from the IDE without the need to use another tool.
ReplyDeleteBut to work you'd need to have Delphi duplicate most of the functionality of the GUI tools. I mean, it's vaguely pretty that NetBeans highlights changes files in the file view, but its diff tool is junk and branch/merge operations don't work as well as the command line (and that's saying something). Could embarcingmad do even that well? I am not confident. Should they do that instead of bug fixes? Hell No!
ReplyDeleteMoz Le They really should put their major focus on the language and the compiler itself. Then on the IDE and providing a proper API (OTA) for 3rd party to build all kinds of extensions. Everything else can be done by 3rd party vendors.
ReplyDeleteStefan Glienke I agree that the most important parts are the language and the compiler. But they will need to polish other areas too. And not all can be left to 3rd party.
ReplyDeleteYou cannot trying to sell modern tool set that only has support for SVN. Currently even no VCS integration at all would look better.
Dalija Prasnikar With a proper infrastructure that would be no big deal but currently the OTA is more like a book with seven seals to most people so they don't bother with it. That and the lacking API for important things like code analysis or refactoring are the reason there are only like a handful top quality IDE plugins out there. And every single of them uses their own code parser to do things.
ReplyDeleteI don't know how much comes with a VS out of the box nowadays for example but who cares with the trillion of plugins that are out there.
Stefan Glienke and these trillion plugins suffer from the same issues in Visual Studio: their API isn't exactly clear either.
ReplyDelete